ScummVM IRC Log - 24 Jul 2017

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[00:01] <criezy> tsoliman: the two lines of code I posted actually compile for me if I had them to the .mm file.
[00:01] <criezy> Although I need to also add a #include "common/events.h" at the top of the file.
[00:01] <snover> tsoliman: since flushing events is backend-dependent, that API should be exposed only through an abstraction, instead of calling SDL directly. however, given what i have seen lately of SDL2 code (where i learned that SDL_WaitEvent is basically a complete fabrication, it just polls in a loop with a SDL_Delay call, what nonsense), it would probably be worth checking that SDL_FlushEvents doesnt just do the same thing as polling until th
[00:01] <snover> e event queue is exhausted
[00:03] <snover> the primary benefit of exposing a flush API is that it can skip all of the extra work that we do in the backend to normalise events, which would be performed when running a loop over pollEvent
[00:06] <criezy> Right. Although it probablly doesn't make a lot of difference in practice. That extra work is not that costly.
[00:06] <tsoliman> criezy: color me embarrassed :)
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[00:08] <tsoliman> snover: isn't the special file browser is also backend dependant? I mean this isn't some common abstract GUI code, it is specific to macOS
[00:10] <tsoliman> SDL_FlushEvents doesn't pop events because it is a filtered delete .. only events that match the filter will be deleted
[00:10] <snover> no, there is no tight coupling between macOS and SDL
[00:11] <tsoliman> fair enough :)
[00:12] <criezy> As I mentioned in my comment on your PR, you could envision a non-SDL backend for macOS.
[00:12] <criezy> I think we actually had a task fro GSoC where we proposed a native coca backend.
[00:12] <tsoliman> right but we don't know if that leak problem is SDL specific or not
[00:13] <tsoliman> I guess it is a no-op if there aren't any leaks
[00:13] <criezy> Indeed. If the issue is only with SDL, when using another backend the fix would just do nothing.
[00:14] <criezy> At least I hope so :P
[00:18] <criezy> I think I might want to partially rewrite the macOS file browser code in the hope that it might fix the occasional cases where it get stuck open in the background.
[00:19] <criezy> If only I could reproduce that reliably to find out what the cause is...
[00:19] <snover> heh. i think i mentioned that same thing a day or two ago
[00:19] <snover> fwiw, i recently changed event flushing code in SCI video player to use a pollEvent loop, it usually took 02ms to complete when i was running timings on it, though i dont know what the breakdown was in terms of cost per function, or if it was I/O bound, and it was with ASan enabled so probably somewhat slower than normal.
[00:21] <snover> relative to a ~16ms frame budget, it seemed to eat up more time than one would probably want, though the picker is so slow anyway with all of its animations i doubt anyone would ever notice here.
[00:22] <tsoliman> I copied it .. typo and all :P
[00:23] <criezy> Feel free to fix the typos :P
[00:24] <tsoliman> done
[00:25] <tsoliman> I should change "Author:" to you :D
[00:26] <tsoliman> ok I like this more - its minor downside is that events are going ScummVM that shouldn't be .. but then are promptly discarded
[00:27] <snover> so i actually got mixed up mother goose deluxe mostly working, these remixes of childrens songs are just bizarre
[00:28] <snover> criezy: what if the repro case for the backgrounded picker is sending events to scummvm that get picked up and cause the file picker to reopen before the old one is fully closed?!?&
[00:30] <criezy> So you mean this might actually get fixed by the PR from tsoliman?
[00:30] <snover> im being optimistic. :)
[00:30] <tsoliman> it definitely fixes some craziness :)
[00:30] <snover> it sounds plausible, though&
[00:32] <tsoliman> ok this newer version that uses eventManager has side effects
[00:33] <tsoliman> e.g. _modifierState and _mousePos and such inside DefaultEventManager are changed
[00:33] <tsoliman> nothing harmful I don't think
[00:34] <tsoliman> I meant to say "I don't think any of the side effects are harmful"
[00:40] <criezy> I will give myself one more day to think about it, and probably merge your PR tomorrow evening (unless I find a better way to handle it) and possibly do some additional changes.
[00:40] <criezy> But it's getting a bit late for me to think about it with a clear mind now.
[00:41] <tsoliman> thanks for the help and suggestions everyone :)
[01:05] <snover> np. thank you for working on it. little things like this matter.
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[01:16] <tsoliman> I found problems in the suggested approach - the events get propagated inside event manager and dispatcher etc and go to all observers .. I don't know if that will cause insanity
[01:17] <tsoliman> I guess it depends on the observer - the original SDL-specific fix doesn't have that problem
[01:18] <tsoliman> probably because it clears the events from SDL before anything goes into EventManager
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[08:45] <waltervn> morning
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[12:12] <GitHub103> [scummvm] dreammaster pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v7LdG
[12:12] <GitHub103> scummvm/master 64cbcba Paul Gilbert: TITANIC: Workaround Conversation area corruption when dragging items...
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[13:42] <Pantheon> Does scummVM have a plain win32 backend? (as in, not using SDL, but directly Win32 api (GDI, etc))
[13:43] <Pantheon> I had a quick look at the source and it looked like it would only be SDL1/2 thats used for windows builds
[13:46] <criezy|Work> Indeed, I think we only have the SDL backend on Windows.
[14:03] <wjp> why do you ask?
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[14:26] <Pantheon> a couple of reasons really
[14:26] <Pantheon> I quite fancy using ScummVM on my windows 95 pc, building it with VC++6.0
[14:26] <Pantheon> I've not looked at building something like SDL1.2 in VC++6.0
[14:27] <Pantheon> but implementing such a backend could be a nice way to learn more about ScummVM and how its implemented
[14:28] <Pantheon> I wanted to ask about it first incase I missed it and it was already present
[14:29] <Pantheon> I would assume such a backend wouldnt have very much of a use-case however since SDL1/2 is avaliable for almost everything
[14:30] <Pantheon> the advantage of running on my Win95 pc is that I can use the OPL3 chip on my Aztech sound card
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[14:44] <waltervn> Pantheon: ScummVM doesn't support OPL3 on Windows yet. Some work was done towards making that possible, but the final step wasn't taken (yet).
[14:46] <Pantheon> oh interesting!
[14:48] <Pantheon> Im happy to have a look at that if there is something I can help out with
[14:49] <Pantheon> I dont really know all of the issues involved of course
[14:50] <Pantheon> other then I have access to one and have done opl3 programming in the past
[14:53] <wjp> ah yes
[14:54] <wjp> by now I've forgotten how far we got exactly
[14:54] <waltervn> basically what we need is some windows-specific code that can send OPL3 commands to a real OPL3 chip
[14:54] <waltervn> we were/are planning to use inpout32 for that, but there was a license issue. That issue has since been resolved, but no further work was done
[14:55] <wjp> did I hack up that linux kernel module for that?
[14:55] <waltervn> I think you did, but no code was submitted upstream right?
[14:55] <waltervn> we have that ALSA FM-api code, which isn't ideal
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[14:56] <wjp> I forgot if I got around to adding an ioctl to send raw commands, but I know I looked into it
[14:57] <wjp> but good that the license issue for inpout32 is resolved
[15:05] <wjp> ah yes, https://github.com/wjp/dosbox/commit/7254faf16549f375fccbf74a545f4e8f8d804a24
[15:06] <wjp> you also had some success on bypassing audio drivers for specific cards entirely in windows it seems
[15:06] <wjp> april 2015, yikes
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[15:09] <waltervn> last I tried it, I had some trouble getting FM on the CM8738 in Windows 10. I had to boot into linux first, then reboot into windows. Probably some enable flag or volume setting that needs to be set...
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[15:12] <waltervn> I got sidetracked before I could figure it out
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[15:14] <waltervn> I think I also got the YMF724 working a few years ago, but the steps I used to get it going didn't work for clone2727.
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[15:17] <waltervn> I suspect it may be related to the YMF730 AC'97 his card has, while all of my YMF7x4 cards use Sigmatel
[15:21] <waltervn> anyway, that too was never figured out
[15:22] <wjp> I have to admit I didn't move my OPL card to my new PC last year... (although I did at least make sure the motherboard has enough room for it)
[15:25] <Pantheon> Very interesting
[15:25] <Pantheon> Previously I accessed the OPL chip just with OUT instructions via inline assembly, but of course that only worked because I was on Windows95
[15:26] <Pantheon> I didnt look much as using an API that would work with more modern NT kernels
[15:26] <wjp> which OS are you on now?
[15:26] <Pantheon> I have a bunch of computers, Windows95, Windows98 and Windows7
[15:26] <Pantheon> I also have some linux VMs for work
[15:26] <waltervn> with inpout32/inpoutx64, it can even be done on Win 10 64-bit. The problem is usually that either there are no drivers for these old cards, or the drivers don't initialize the FM part
[15:30] <Pantheon> InpOut looks really interesting
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[15:53] <waltervn> Pantheon: You're using an ISA card I suppose?
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[15:55] <Pantheon> Indeed yep
[15:55] <Pantheon> I have a bunch of them
[15:55] <Pantheon> also some PCI card, a crytal audio thing
[15:55] <Pantheon> or wait, I have two PCI cards
[15:56] <Pantheon> But I think they have some OPL emulator build into the ASIC
[15:56] <waltervn> for PCI the YMF-724/744/754 are pretty good, but no drivers for recent versions of windows
[15:56] <waltervn> for PCI express I'm only aware of one card, that uses a CMI8738 chip. That's an OPL3 clone, but it's not bad
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[15:57] <waltervn> CMI8738 does have drivers, but they don't enable the OPL3
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[15:58] <Strangerke> hi guys
[15:58] <waltervn> hi Strangerke
[15:58] <Pantheon> hey
[15:58] <Pantheon> Oh nice i've not heard of these cards
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[16:12] <WooShell> meow =^.^=
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[16:24] <tsoliman> Lost Eden 60% off on GOG https://www.gog.com/game/lost_eden
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[18:17] <tsoliman> snover: you asked to be notified if I end up exposing SDL_FlushEvents .. and I have
[18:21] <tsoliman> is there a good place to create a diagram in .. for event data flow .. maybe the wiki?
[18:22] <tsoliman> I keep having to remember how everything is wired together and I was going to create a diagram for myself, but then I thought maybe others will find it useful
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[18:23] <wjp> if it fits in text, I'd say in common/events.h, otherwise probably wiki, yes
[18:25] <wjp> in text form in the header is probably more likely to be found
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[19:24] <wjp> rebuilding all engines really is starting to take a long time
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[19:35] <m_kiewitz> tsoliman: any idea if GOG ever had a humble bundle / humble bundle sold GOG keys?
[19:37] <wjp> do you mean like in https://www.humblebundle.com/store/everspace ?
[19:37] <wjp> (or specifically for Lost Eden?)
[19:38] <tsoliman> m_kiewitz: they did have one yes
[19:38] <tsoliman> but you had to pick upfront
[19:39] <tsoliman> I mean you had to pick either/or when it came to GOG/Steam
[19:39] <tsoliman> this is off of memory so I could be misremembering
[19:39] <m_kiewitz> wjp: nah, I meant an actual humble bundle
[19:39] <tsoliman> if I had to guess it would be a bundle that had the witcher in it
[19:40] <m_kiewitz> like the current ones, just without steam drm
[19:40] <tsoliman> because witcher and gog are both CDProjeckt
[19:40] <m_kiewitz> tsoliman: any idea which games were in that bundle?
[19:40] <tsoliman> let me look
[19:41] <tsoliman> "Humble Weekly Sale: Celebrating Open Source"
[19:41] <tsoliman> the one gog game was "Defender's Quest: Valley of the Forgotten"
[19:41] <tsoliman> and they offered both Steam and GOG for that one
[19:42] <tsoliman> (you could redeem both .. so it wasn't the one I am thinking of)
[19:42] <tsoliman> they repeated the same deal with "Humble Weekly Bundle: Leading Ladies"
[19:43] <tsoliman> and I believe there was a bundle with Broken Age too .. I am only able to search the bundles I actually bought .. not all of them
[19:43] <m_kiewitz> but no regular humble bundle yet?
[19:43] <m_kiewitz> ah Broken Age, damn missed that one
[19:43] <tsoliman> not in my library
[19:44] <m_kiewitz> they currently have a Capcom Resident Evil one
[19:44] <m_kiewitz> which is quite good I think, but I have all the games already on consoles
[19:44] <m_kiewitz> and a Telltale one, which is also pretty nice especially the cheap $1 tier
[19:44] <tsoliman> the way I am doing it is via Library->Keys-> seach for "gog"
[19:44] <m_kiewitz> ah
[19:44] <m_kiewitz> i really liked the last Nintendo humble bundle
[19:45] <m_kiewitz> tons of great games in it
[19:45] <m_kiewitz> still waiting for the 2017 Nintendo bundle
[19:47] <tsoliman> criezy: I will test this some more tonight .. I am done with my work break now and will work for the next 4 or so hours
[19:48] <tsoliman> (GMT-5)
[19:53] <criezy> tsoliman: OK. I will be busy with other tasks this evening anyway.
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[21:28] <snover> tsoliman: thanks for letting me know!
[21:30] <snover> i have notifications for that so when i see it land i will change the sci video player to use it.
[21:31] <snover> with regards to the event system design, i have been struggling with the graphics backend code for probably similar reasons
[21:33] <kgbme> some games.. keyboard has to be used.. and it doesn't memorise that it's switched to its second function: so every time gotta go through with it.. since support was mentioned. :) I'd be cool to have programmable Macro buttons as well, displayed on Android
[21:33] <kgbme> :-$
[21:33] <kgbme> I'm sure it's impossible, just saying. =)
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[21:43] <snover> when sdl2 support was added, it was done in a make this work like sdl1 manner. which i suppose made sense at the time, but sdl seems to be pretty leaky abstraction, so (for me, at the moment) everything is kind of a nightmare. plus there is the opengl stuff which i do not really understand. (is it still relevant even though SDL2 allows opting-in to hardware acceleration?)
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[21:56] Action: Raziel^ hugs dreammaster
[21:59] Action: dreammaster says thanks :)
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[22:13] <Raziel^> dreammaster and Strangerke in one room!!! ... magic about to happen...
[22:14] <dreammaster> Yeh, one of these days we'll get back to collaborating on another game. Probably one of the pending MADS or Access games
[22:14] <Strangerke> hey :)
[22:14] <dreammaster> G'day yourself :)
[22:15] <Strangerke> yeah, or yet another exotic super harcoded game :P
[22:15] <Raziel^> Altered Destiny please!!!
[22:15] <Strangerke> oh, yes :) Accolade engine :)
[22:16] <Raziel^> He said YES!!!!!
[22:16] Action: Raziel^ dancing
[22:16] <Raziel^> :-D
[22:16] <Strangerke> Currently I'm still on Kingdom, though
[22:16] <dreammaster> And of course, I want to finish Xeen off once I'm done with Titanic
[22:17] <Strangerke> And Cadaver.
[22:17] <Strangerke> O:^)
[22:18] <Raziel^> Strangerke: kingdom?
[22:18] <Strangerke> Kingdom: The far reaches
[22:19] <Raziel^> never heard that one
[22:19] Action: Raziel^ looks it up
[22:19] <Raziel^> thought it may be kingdom of magic
[22:20] <wjp> (on sale on gog now, by the way)
[22:22] <Raziel^> lloks like a mixture of an early disney movie and that amiga laserisc game where you had to run from a dragon
[22:22] <Deledrius> Dragon's Lair?
[22:23] <Deledrius> There's a reason why it has similarity to Disney animation... ;)
[22:23] <Raziel^> Deledrius: thank you, yes, exactly this
[22:25] <Strangerke> Well, if you look at the credits, you'll find some name in common
[22:25] <Strangerke> The same with Braindead13, which could be worked on too, btw
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[22:37] <tsoliman> Dragon's Lair (and space ace and space ace 2) apparent just got remastered this month. Better quality than the other CD/DVD versions I guess?
[22:38] <tsoliman> Also it seems the DVD version is a literal DVD
[22:40] <tsoliman> The GOG reviews for Kingdom are rough
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[22:54] <GitHub122> [scummvm] wjp opened pull request #975: Rework and optimize Common::BitStream (master...bitstream) https://git.io/v7q2v
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[22:58] <wjp> that changes the whole BitStream interface, and is overall slightly risky
[22:58] <wjp> but the levels of indirection for reading a single bit from a memory buffer were a bit crazy :-)
[23:01] <m_kiewitz> tsoliman: no blu-ray release?
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[23:01] <wjp> (do a virtual call to the bitstream class, then two virtual calls to the bitstream pos and size functions, and four virtual calls to the underlying stream's size, pos, eos and err functions, followed by a virtual call to read a single byte.)
[23:02] <wjp> (*shudder* :-) )
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[23:15] <snover> wjp: yikes.
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[23:18] <snover> did you happen to run code coverage on the tests as long as you were there changing them?
[23:18] <wjp> I didn't really change them
[23:18] <wjp> (and, no)
[23:19] <wjp> would probably be useful
[23:19] <snover> ah, yeah, that was a poor choice of words on my part.
[23:25] <wjp> do you have a favourite tool for that?
[23:26] <Lightkey> my axe!
[23:26] <snover> think i just used gcov & genhtml
[23:27] <Lightkey> never even knew you could spell it ax, thanks auto correction
[23:28] <snover> thats how you spell it on a 16-bit processor
[23:34] <wjp> :-)
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[00:00] --- Tue Jul 25 2017